Bad Math

Two plus two

Something Doesn’t Add Up

Trying to argue or debate with Christian Apologists is like trying to spar with fog. They’re never quite ‘there.’ They move the goalposts, or change the definitions. When they argue their positions, they add just enough reality to make it seem real. 2 + 2 doesn’t quite equal 4. They will claim 3.97 or 4.04, hoping that skeptics will concede the tiny difference.

They hold up portions of the Bible which are historically correct, and then claim that it ALL is. See, the Bible mentions Jerusalem, and Jerusalem exists, so the Bible must be true. It’s when you ask them to prove the existence of Sodom and Gomorrah, that the tap-dancing begins.

A very small percentage of archeology remains after three to four thousand years.
A very small percentage of surviving archeology has been discovered.
Of what archeology has been discovered, a very small percentage of it has actually been dug.
Of the archeological digs, only a small percentage of the total area is actually exposed.
Only a tiny fraction of what has been examined and published, has anything to do with the Bible.
Of the unidentified digs, one of them might have been Sodom, or Gomorrah.

Yeah??! And it MIGHT have been Jephthah’s bait shop and sailboard rental. We’re getting down to dancing on the head of that argumental pin.

A YouTuber complained that Atheists are so closed-minded, that even if they observed a miracle, they wouldn’t change their minds. As Proof, he quoted the story of Christ raising Lazarus from the dead. The Jewish leaders plotted to have both Jesus and Lazarus murdered, because all Christ’s miracles were bad for their business. But that was because they believed that the miracles were real. They accepted Christ’s divinity. The circular reasoning is hardly the best example to refute Atheists with.

One Apologist admitted that Christianity had got many things wrong, but defended its existence as a possible font of additional hunches/intuitions/guesses about the universe and reality, which science could then investigate, and either prove or disprove. Contrary to usual dogma, he insisted that Christianity and the Bible should be viewed as allegory, and not taken literally. What did I think about that?

That idea sounds weak and desperate. So far, EVERY one of religions’ wild-ass guesses/intuitions/hunches has proved wrong. I don’t think that any one of them need make any more. If organized logic and science can’t intuit something new, ‘Conspiracy Theory’ is the new growth industry.

Besides, Religion is the bully on the block. No Flat Earther has ever threatened me with eternal torment in Hell, or even worse, stretched me on a rack, burned me at the stake, or protested at my funeral because I had the audacity to serve in the military to defend my country, just because I thought the Earth was round.

No Area 51 fanatic has ever put det-cord around my neck and blown my head off, tossed me off a 10-storey building, or put me in a cage and drowned me, because I didn’t believe that the government performed an autopsy on an alien there in 1947.

I don’t feel that we should give any sanction or acceptance to most religions. It only validates and encourages the worst among them. They, and their desperate, insecure, ego-driven adherents, can be quite retrogressive and dangerous.

If you can’t take religion at face value, why take it at all? Playing ‘Pretend’ is for children.

20 thoughts on “Bad Math

  1. dbenn says:

    Echoing some of your comments about beliefs that don’t threaten you, I wrote awhile ago about “what counts as good belief?”


    • Archon's Den says:

      I question your use of the phrase, beliefs that don’t threaten you. Just tonight, I saw a meme stating that the fact that Donald Trump was elected by a large bloc of voters who see him as doing God’s work, was one of the strongest arguments for Atheism. 😛
      Your article was a good one, although I take exception to your statement that children will begin to question as they get older. Not young children. Most of them will blindly keep believing. They may question Santa, or the Easter Bunny, but the constant reaffirmation of their particular religion by parents, preachers, and all other authority figures actively discourages questioning. It’s not until those few lucky late-teens/early 20s go to university or college and see that other opinions are possible, that they become Atheists.
      Anyway, thanx for the visit and the blog-post. Let’s do it again. 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

  2. Hi Archon’s Den,
    You make some fair points about threats and killing done by religious people. But atheists have killed millions too. It seems that killing is a human problem, not exclusively a religious people problem.
    I don’t need to prove every historical event mentioned in the Bible in order to believe the Bible is historically reliable- just like you don’t need to test every bottle of ibuprofen before you swallow the pills. You trust that the bottle of ibuprofen you buy is going to be reliable based on your experience and knowledge. You could be wrong. That bottle could have been mishandled, tampered with, or could be altogether fake. But you are willing to swallow those pills even though your bottle hasn’t been tested. In the same way, I can’t prove that Sodom and Gomorrah existed, but I believe it. I don’t need evidence for every story in the Bible. There is archeological evidence that corroborates many historical events and people in the Bible, and that is enough to consider it generally reliable. Archon’s Den, your life would become unmanageable if you required the same level of evidence in every area as you are demanding in regard to God.


  3. I stay away from all discussions of religion. I don’t need any more trolls on my site.

    Changing the subject – I know Canadians don’t generally celebrate our Thanksgiving, but I wish you and your family the best. Hope you’re staying warm and snow-free.


    • Archon's Den says:

      We’re not getting much choice about celebrating American thanksgiving. ‘Black Friday’ sales are as thick as witnesses at Trump’s impeachment hearings.
      I believe that some of them passed off a Midwest storm to us. Temp is almost 50F (real) degrees, but 50 MPH wind gusts, and enough rain to make me consider Ken Ham’s Ark Experience. 😉

      Liked by 2 people

  4. “Jephthah’s bait shop and sailboard rental”, love it….

    Liked by 1 person

  5. 1jaded1 says:

    Yes. Religion is the 4 multiplied by 2 letter word here.


  6. I was raised Protestant Christian in the Bible Belt, but by the time I was 16 I couldn’t make my logical, rational self accept anymore the malarkey I’d been fed in the name of religion. For a while, I equivocated by saying I was agnostic, but I eventually made the short leap to full-blown atheism. I’m 75 years old now, still an atheist, and very comfortable being one. I doubt there will be any death-bed conversion back to accepting religious nonsense in my future.
    However, there is an exception to my atheism: I don’t believe in heaven or hell, but I do believe in the Rainbow Bridge for dogs, where they all will be young and well again; and for cats I believe in Kitty Kat Lane, where the sun always shines, and all the mice are slow and fat.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Archon's Den says:

      I also recently turned 75. There’s no going back for me either. Actually, I was raised in a small Southern Ontario town where your religion was about as important as what color car you drove.
      If only I could also cross the Rainbow bridge, or walk Kitty Kat lane, and be re-united with all the cats and dogs that I’ve loved so much, and who loved me so much.
      Thanx for the visit and lovely comment. 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

  7. Matt Scott says:

    I fully concur with you here. I’ve been re reading a lot of Bertrand Russell and Hitch and I completely agree that religion poisons everything and brings out the absolute worst in humanity. Oh to see it fully die so reason can have its full glory.


    • Archon's Den says:

      It’s like hating cars, when all that really pisses you off, are the horns that a few idiots honk at you. If the well-mannered silent majority want to get together and sing some songs and recite some magic incantations together, practicing self-hypnosis and self-delusion, I’m okay with that. It’s just that I have better things to do with my mind, and my time.

      It’s the 5% loud, insecure, nasty, judgmental minority who tell me that I’m evil, and immoral, and should be sent to Hell, (some even offer to send me immediately), or claim that I shouldn’t get legally-guaranteed rights, who bug me. They can’t even agree among themselves, except that they all hate Atheists, because we scare the Hell out of them (literally). 😯


  8. Joseph Malone says:

    people have the right to be stupid and make up dumb shit as long as it does not infringe on your freedom. Now Wasps enslaving Africans and making the worship white Jesus was racist and caused lots of problems racially so pretty much all Christians are scum. If you can’t see that then you are not qualified to fight against an already defeated opponent.

    It is less they “cheat” when debating but more you waste time talking to idiots. You thinking debating a christian is hard? Try telling a crackhead crack is bad? They don’t listen so you have to write them off as their word don’t mean shit. Know on the other hand you could just suffer from respecting your opponent to much. That is naive and doomed to fail. Your opponent wins because he understands the precept of war better. While you are debating as friends he is attacking and defending like an enemy with a mandate and stated purpose. You reason for discourse is trivial but his is mission critical so unless you have as much staked in victory as he does you win lose. He does not believe he religion to be true (unless delusional and you can’t fix retarded) no he is a pathological liar bent on world domination through the great work of ages and manifest destiny. And you approach that highly organized front put up by him with some namby pamby grassroots, make it up as you go along tactic and strategy? Hmmm… no longer your losing. You haven’t properly identified the root causes for the conflict nor given much thought to your opponents true objectives.

    You should probably find better hobbies than inciting religious cultural warfare. That is better left to the professionals. I am moving into the Vatican. Thanks for reminding me.


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